PH_EVENT_FDR_CTRL_SAFETY_CIRCUIT_OPEN_WARN_PILE
KB0032365
Case Study
Customer: [Link] Call ID: CS15358705
Product: HP Indigo 10r / 50010006 Press SW: 10070.0.0.47 I-
Fix1.i27
Issue Status / Reported problem Description:
Error: ILK_CIRCUIT_BREAK_OPEN / Circuit breaker 6 is open.
F6 (Feeder) on PDU tripped, Issue happened during production
Ended ip, 24V/48 power error on feeder in MMI, reset F6 and
powercycle, and dead pile/no lights, not functional
New error: on user interface warning, LED_FEEDER_FAIL_PILE
PH_EVENT_FDR_INTERNAL_COMMUNICATION_ERROR_PILE / Pile, DPC, unknown,
FMC
Parts Consumed: color codes / Verified
Defect / Miscellaneous / Unrelated
1 x CU498-02140 FUSE LITTELFUSE 5A - F2 FMC
1 x CU498-01783 PCA1 FEED MANAGEMENT CONTROLLER
1 x CU498-02040 MOTOR SK1SI75
1 x CU498-02972 CONVERTER, FREQUENCY MR
2 x CU498-02490 PCA, MICONTROL
2 x CU498-02480 CONTROLLER, MOTION
1 x CU498-06820 SIDEBLOWER FLAT CABLE (proactive replaced as
suspect of common shortcircuit/boken)
1 x CU498-01672 SIDE BLOWER KPL 10000 MR (physical damage, not
related to issue)
1 x CU498-03083 LEVER PAPER PRESENT CPL PILE
1 x CU498-02230 ENCODER, INCREMENTAL ROTARY, TVI40
1 x CU498-01851 PCA1 BLOWER DISTRIBUTION BOARD
1 x CU498-02320 RELAY, FINDER 24V2UM
REVERSE Root cause analyses:
Suspected ROOT cause for Initial Issue , according to below findings.
Pile Lift CU498-02040 MAIN MOTOR, a shortcircuit in brake rectifier,
Result F6 on PDU tripped as expected,
but did not prevent flashover to FMC low voltage circuit, in Pile Relay.
How could this blow FMC fuse F2, and fry internal power supplies,
as well as fry multiple other electronics?
This brake short-circuit should only blow F6 on PDU,
and ‘probably would’ even burn contact in Pile Relay contact, that’s it!
Looking at relay, there was a flashover at relay contacts, due to shorted Lift
Motor Brake rectifier.
Since old relay full lacked physical barrier/wall, seem this spark also reached
2th contact
receiving FMC-24V_LOG. Causing F2 at FMC to trip as well as fry lot of
electronics, and ….
Conclusion:
Probably this new received relay type,
would have prevented the chain of events,
flashover to Low voltage electronics/PCA’s,
multiple part failures/replacements
The Story Troubleshooting steps / actions taken / parts replaced, to find the
problem and resolve Case
Initial Diagnoses
Remote:
20 seconds before there was an event in event log, related … not sure
PH_EVENT_FDR_CRTL_SAFETY_CIRCUIT_OPEN_WARN_PILE
feeder safe pulse block was triggered while the pile lift inverter controller of
pile was being enabled
event itself: ILK_CIRCUIT_BREAK_OPEN / Circuit breaker 6 is open
after restart Pile dead, error :
PH_EVENT_FDR_INTERNAL_COMMUNICATION_ERROR_PILE ….
Checked remote with operator LEDS 24V and 48V were on, so PWR is supplied,
I requested operator to order some fuses for FMC just in case of .... arranged
visit
Onsite ….
1th visit
24V and 48V to FMC O.K.
other internal voltages not existing, found F2 on FMC tripped 24V_LOG
replaced FMC F2 (5A), 24V_LOG is O.K. now, but no internal
3.3/12/VCC? Progress made !
10 minutes after replacing F2, U12 burned (smoke/flame) on FMC ? SetBack !!!
onboard VCC power supply, supplying power to 3.3V onboard pwr supply
aswell,
checked fuse F2 again, fuse still O.K. and F6 on PDU aswell didn’t trip !?
measured VCC resistance to ground, 1 ohm. (this is to low, but was it because
of burned onboard PWR supply?)
continues tested resistance while disconnecting all cables to FCM, resistance
did not change ....
still not clear what was relation for this strange PWR defect, and relation to trip
of F6 on PDU how problem started?
ordered FMC to continue
(currently press is in production, can not swap parts between drawer and pile,
to prevent MD situation)
2th Visit:
installed new Pile FMC installed minimal cables connected,
FMC is allive and all required Power arrives, and is generated onboard
Besides vistually checking, no root cause / pinched / loose cable found ….
One-by-one connected cables (safety related first), power cycling Feeder
Reason … if there was external short, at least to know what cable was causing
defect
FMC power remains O.K. ? when all cables to FMC connected
booted press, Pile FW flashed O.K. according Logs, so progress again!
but recieved new error: communication problem with BLDC 0
PH_EVENT_FDR_INDEX_INTERNAL_COMMUNICATION_ERROR_PILE
tested Lift movement of file is strange aswell only moves partially, to bottom
and little up, warning
PH_EVENT_FDR_MTR_ENCODER_WRONG_DIRECTION_WARN_PILE
Sometimes no Lift movement at all, using buttons on Feeder
seems problem with communication to BLDC MiControl,
in princare tested communication to both modules fails, this is CAN3
communication
All test related to Pile Lift were greyed out aswell
but strangely communication to Pile frequency converter passed ? wich is last
in CAN3 bus line
checked Can termination, found can termination CN3,CN4,CN30 installed
but CN19 was not installed (also not on old FMC)
installed jumper CN19 aswell, but same issue remained
Escallated issue to Tier3, log files actually didn’t really help digging
deeper, finding root cause, prevent blowing FMC
Ordered: PCA, MICONTROL/ CONTROLLER MOTION/ CONVERTER,
FREQUENCY MR/ MOTOR SK1SI75
3th visit:
BLDC/Mi-Control parts in backorder ETA , urgency pushes to continue,
decided to ….
try removing one CAN3 BLDC module from chain issue remains, BLDC 0
communication ?
disconnecting Pile frequency converter (lift) popped me additional
communication , so there was communication.
Since log already showed
PH_EVENT_FDR_CTRL_SAFETY_CIRCUIT_OPEN_WARN_PILE, and operator
Also complained complained he could not load similar Pile Height
compared to Indigo 12000
Similar cases most of time caused by Motor Brake, replaced MOTOR
SK1S175, but issue remains.
Also replaced CONVERTER, FREQUENCY MR, since we noticed Encoder
wrong Direction, but issue remains
Printcare test also showed 100% probability for both BDLC motors not
working is MiControl
Still Root cause of defect not found, requested second set BLDC PCA
and Mi-Control waiting BO to arrive
REMOTE:
saved log files remote, odo Tier3, from the time of occurenced, plus
and minus 2 hours, logs shared.
4th Onsite:
Replaced Both sets BLDC PCA with MiControl, finally got tornado belt &
feed motor running, progress made !
Still lot of tests fail related to lift, very rarely see any movement.
After press boot no error, but when reset, immediate LED_FEEDER_FAIL_PILE
error continue complaining on wrong direction, home not found, while seeing
no lift movement
manually testing all other sensors and motors seem functional, encoders can
not really check
tried to read encoder position in COM1 terminal, but seems very high for pile
wich is almost on floor
Requested, Lift Encoder, top of stack sensor and proactive Side Blower flat
cables
5th Onsite:
Connected USB straight to FMC5 (Pile) this is result:
Replaced Top of stack sensor and preventive side blower flat cables, issue
remained, flat cables no issues found
Challenge to replace lift encoder as locking screw was not centered
with hole in gear,
had to move Chain/gears just enough to reach screw and replace
encoder
At the end powering up feeder, finally have Lift movement, huge
progress !
Moved lift Up/down …. Second time with pallet an 10cm of paper
Noticed Strange electronic burned smell and intermittend high pitch
noise, lift motor already very warm 32 degr.C
Setback, this made me worry, again burned smell …… decided to do
full press shutdown/restart
Verified, if nothing shifted during encoder replacement, or blocking
movement of the lift
After restart, in diagnostic, ran all diagnostic tests for Feeder Pile
Top of stack sensor and encoder failed, aswell as 3 sideblowers failed
test, and intermittend with/length adj.
Test was interrupted again LED_FEEDER_FAIL_PILE, feeder safe pulse
block was triggered lift inverter.
For sideblowers (as already Sideblower flatcables were replaced)
swapped sideblowers,
but error remained on Position, so this was resolved by replacing distribution
PCA. Progress again!
Again noticed the burned smell while running above diagnostic tests, sniffing
and measuring temperatures
Finally reached Motor Brake as Cause for this smell 42 degrees C, and rising
close to brake on motor.
Opened connection panel of motor, smell didn’t come from motor internally. ?
Checked for Voltage on Lift motor Brake, according wiring should be 220V AC at
input of brake rectifier
But strange thing, safety off/on, motor moving or standstill, never measured
220V AC
Checked wiring again and found when safety signal is good, relay should supply
220V AC to disable brake.
So currently brake is always ON, when motor is turning, generating smell and
heat !! again progress !
Measured at relay contacts, 220V AC arrives at contactor, but when relay
switches, no output from contactor
Cause of Voltage not arriving at motor brake, is burned contact on Pile relay
Blocked lightcurtain, to disable motor movement for now and, ordered new Pile
relay
6th onsite:
When new Relay arrived, before installing was still curious on reason
for this heavy burned contact,
Decided to measure resistance @ motor rectifier (expect high
impedance)
Even more curious, decided to open cover of relay, looking at
internals,
still searching Root cause of chain of events, don’t know what/why this brake
shorted out, but ….
verified this Brake has a short-circuit, which should cause F6 on PDU to
trip! Progress in identifying root cause!
The initial Real recorded event! but what about all the electronics burned as
well?
Off course switching 220V AC, to something that is shorted out,
will initially generate a spark, before fuse trips
Check following pictures of relay contacts:
Now check last picture NEW RELAY, notice difference,
there is new additional physical separation between contactor switches for
preventing flashovers.
Old relay there was only small short plastic insulation at the top of the
contactor.
Look how burnmarks on the second contactor in relay, I suspect FLASHOVER !!!
But what is switched with 2th contactor?
Looking at wiring diagram quickly, see it switches 24V_LOG from FMC5
…. Hmmm , this seems to ring a bell
Offcourse, this could be reason for F2 on FMC5 to burn, as already found in first
onsite visit
And could also explain defective electronics, connected to 24V_LOG at FMC5
and external electronics at FMC5
Replaced relay, and lift working, no smell, moving smooth no noises, still error
in UI ? LED_FEEDER_FAIL_PILE
Keep cool, full shutdown HW/SW, restart, tested all, no errors no more, all test
pass, papertransport pass
Tested production,
all O.K. Case closed
Finally, I am relieved, I feel I can explain what happened. (allthoug took
multiple parts/visits)
Also I have good confidence, with the new relay,
where Relay internal contactors are separated by Physical wall, should prevent
flashover,
in case motor brake shorts out, preventing multiple Electronic failures.